More blithe racism

[Dingfod]

Army regulation just issued says "negro" is okay for referring to soldiers of African descent.

[ImGod]

Originally Posted by Dingfod

Army regulation just issued says "negro" is okay for referring to soldiers of African descent.

The old ladies in my wife's home town refer to them as "Neeegros". Emphasis on the Neee part makes it sound much more proper and southern. The old guys in the home town aren't as proper.

In mixed company (i.e. don't know all the people in the room) they refer to them as "Those People" instead.

[Dingfod]

Some of the not-so-genteel folk of my southern acquaint fearlessly use the word "nigger" now, not in public, but when conversing amongst themselves, or people they think are of like mind. Back in the 1960s, those same people would have said "that colored boy/girl", reserving the slur above for miscreants and uppity colored folk that didn't know their place.

[Dingfod]

Exit Pollsters in South Carolina asked voters if blacks were "too demanding" and "trying hard enough".

[erimir]

I don't get why people were offended.

They should be offended that so many people were likely to agree with the racist sentiments, not that people were asked about them.

Ok, I get why conservatives were offended. Because they know a study is about to come out that will make them look bad.

[lisarea]

I'd be offended if someone came up to me and started asking me questions about "blacks," especially if they're buttonholing me outside a voting booth. It almost smells like some kind of push poll or something.

But I am pre-offended by strangers asking me nosy questions anyways.

[Ari]

Yeah I think I would be at least annoyed to be asked clearly loaded questions about 'blacks' especially since these questions come from Dr. Woodard," He is the author or co-author of seven books including THE NEW SOUTHERN POLITICS (2013), and RONALD REAGAN: A BIOGRAPHY (2012). In addition he is a political consultant for Republican candidates."

So I doubt whatever study can be made from yes/no answers to loaded questions by a conservative consultant is going to actually come out if it makes conservatives look bad.

[erimir]

Well I didn't realize he was a Republican. That doesn't prove he would be misrepresenting his data. These questions are standard, like he said. Poisoning the well is not justified even if he is a Republican. It's possible that he was trying to use the occasion of Tim Scott's election to push a misleading narrative that white South Carolinians are not racist, but this news story and his use of common sociological survey questions don't demonstrate that.

It is true that I have seen those same questions asked in sociological studies that discuss racism. It's not hard to find them. Here's a chapter from a 1988 sociology textbook: http://www.issr.ucla.edu/sears/pubs/A085.pdf
Here's a list of questions from a 1986 textbook: Social Psychology
Another article from 1997: http://www.issr.ucla.edu/sears/pubs/A124.pdf including these questions:

(5) If blacks would only try harder they could be just as well off as whites (1986 and 1992 NES).
(6) Irish, Italians, Jewish, and many other minorities overcame prejudice and worked their
way up. Blacks should do the same without special favors (all surveys).
(7) Most blacks who receive money from welfare programs could get along without it if they tried (1986 NES).

One from 2005, using the "too demanding" and "more than they deserve" questions: http://data.psych.udel.edu/abelcher/...15)/Powell.pdf

I'm pretty sure I saw the exact list of questions from the 1997 article in my sociology classes in undergrad, used as a measure of "symbolic racism".

Racists/Republicans/conservatives do like to complain about undeserving poor (read: blacks) getting more government handouts than they deserve. They do say that racism isn't a problem anymore, which implies it's a matter of trying (combine this with arguing that blacks urban youth don't succeed b/c they have a "culture of dependency" and view academic achievement as "acting white"). They also frequently complain about prominent activists "race hustlers" (usually Sharpton and Jackson, sometimes Ben Jealous, William Barber and others) and people pushing for "special rights".

A lot of racists aren't going to see those as questions where there's a "racist" answer. That's the point. They're more obvious than many questions are nowadays, but it's more subtle than "Are you a racist?".

The fact is that Sen. Tim Scott, who used to work for Strom Thurmond, is a Republican precisely because despite being black, he would argue that it is a matter of trying for poor blacks. He did it, and so can other blacks. He reassures white Republicans that they aren't racist. He gives them an opportunity to call liberals racist (including black anti-racism activists!) when they criticize Scott for being a Republican due to his opposition to policies that will fight racism or treat its symptoms. He was in favor of voting schemes that effectively disenfranchised blacks in his hometown (by making all city council districts at-large, the white majority made it so no candidate black voters preferred could be elected. And Tim Scott's blackness was the evidence that this was not actually a problem). So it is an interesting question as to how white voters would respond to these questions, given that 1. they just voted for a black politician but 2. that politician would endorse some of the anti-black answers in the survey. I wouldn't be surprised if they were more likely to answer with the racist responses, given that they had just given themselves a talisman against accusations of racism. That is, "how can I be a racist for answering that way?! I just voted for a black guy!"

The fact that so many people recognized them as having a racist or "racist" answer suggests that those questions might not be very useful anymore though. Non-racists will see them as having a racist answer, of course, but perhaps now it's also the case that some racists recognize how the answers will be viewed. Thus they get "offended" because they realize the purpose of the questions (to expose them). Or possibly, cynical Republicans who are not racist per se might have recognized the implications for how their fellow Republicans would answer. Why the left wingers were offended, I don't know. Are they upset that the interviewer thought they were potentially racist? Or was it because they were racist?

The versions Woodard used were worded slightly differently and he only used three, do you think that is the problem with them? He removed the word "economically" from the "less than they deserve" question (although in most of the other surveys, there were two questions along those lines, one about economics, the other about the media). The others seem to be verbatim the same. Maybe cutting it down to three is bad, since it leaves out the other, more subtle questions like the one about Italians and Jews or asking which they agree with here: "Some say civil rights people have been trying to push too fast. Others feel they haven't pushed fast enough."

Otherwise I don't see what the problem is. I don't see them as leading questions pushing a racist narrative. They're questions that have been used by many sociologists who were not pushing a racist narrative (usually quite the opposite) who are interested in understanding white racial attitudes and how best to address them.

Are white liberals so self-conscious about seeming racist that now we can't even try to measure racism because they'll get "offended"? To me, it seems counterproductive. Stopping researchers from asking questions like these seems aimed at avoiding making white people uncomfortable, rather than about fighting racism.

[beyelzu]

From the article on the Clemson poll.


"If nothing else, this is proof that academics need to descend from their ivory towers every so often and take the real world’s measure."

Isn't that what the professors were doing, taking the real worlds measure?

[Dingfod]

Originally Posted by Dingfod

Army regulation just issued says "negro" is okay for referring to soldiers of African descent.

Army revised policy today. The Army Just Decided That Soldiers Cannot Be Referred To As 'Negros' | ThinkProgress

[Janet]

Sure, we could sit here and ask ourselves whether we, as White people, think Black people should be offended. All I can tell you is that Mick was seriously pissed, and I completely understand why.

[Ari]

Kim Kardashians oh so edgey booty photoset is just rehashed racism.
Kim Kardashian doesn’t realize she’s the butt of an old racial joke | theGrio
(NSFW due to boobs)

show spoiler

From the photo book "Jungle fever" by Jean Paul Goude.

[vremya]

#pointergate hits The Daily Show!

Jon Stewart Adds #Pointergate to ˜Innocent Things...

[Watser?]

Here's a trailer for a documentary on Dutch tv about Zwarte Piet (Black Pete):

Our Colonial Hangover - YouTube

[LadyShea]

Originally Posted by Watser?

Here's a trailer for a documentary on Dutch tv about Zwarte Piet (Black Pete):

Gah I read some comments

[mickthinks]

OMG ubiquitous Russell Brand really is ubiquitous!

[ShottleBop]

In Milwaukee.

Don't read the comments. (READ THE COMMENTS.)

[Janet]

A study shows White people believe that Black people have magical powers. My theory of this is that people heard the term Magical Negro without context and came up with their own interpretations. That or they think Black Dynamite is a documentary.

[BrotherMan]

Black Dynamite isn't a documentary?

[Ari]

Well yeah, dark skinned people are exotic and closer to animals, thus they have nature magic, just like mystical Native Americans, duh, it's science!

[The Man]

Post-Racial America Update, Simple Minds Edition » Balloon Juice

tl;dr: the Republican Party of Nevada had no problem making their Speaker a guy who uses the word "darkies".

ETA: More on this guy from Wonkette: Incoming Nevada Speaker Ira Hansen Is Your New Favorite Wingnut

He seems nice.

[Ari]

My favorite comment on that wonkette article was, "Ira, sounds kinda Jewy!"
Especially when I realized Ira is Ari backwards.

I sometimes wonder if part of the bump in liberals voting in primary election years is related to the nutball wins conservatives get in off years. Conservative groups are great in theory when they speak of things in vagueness and wag their underdog tails but as soon as they get into power and really open their mouths it shoots them in the foot and people realize just what kind of crazy is now in power.

[ImGod]

Originally Posted by Janet

A study shows White people believe that Black people have magical powers. My theory of this is that people heard the term Magical Negro without context and came up with their own interpretations. That or they think Black Dynamite is a documentary.

If they didn't have 10 inch + dicks we'd think they weren't magic.

[Dingfod]

Rupert Murdoch defends the casting of the Exodus movie.

Originally Posted by Murdoch on Twitter

Moses film attacked on Twitter for all white cast. Since when are Egyptians not white? All I know are.

[livius drusus]

I have split the Michael Brown/Ferguson discussion to a new thread here.