A revolution in thought

[peacegirl]

I just wanted to say that I'm not going to continue the discussion if Lone Ranger cannot accept that science could be wrong, because there's no point. Lessans will be viewed as a jerk, a crackpot, and an ignoramus, and I'm not going to let people disrespect him in this way. Very few people are interested in the actual book. Why? Because they are being influenced negatively. They are using the responses to determine if there could be something of value, and if they don't see anyone even considering that there could be something worth considering, why read a 600 page book? I know what they're thinking. They have given up on the legitimacy of Lessans claims; now they are using this as entertainment, similar to a dog fight and they are transfixed on this thread to see who wins. It has nothing to do with the knowledge being presented. I'm not interested in this at all, and if someone else doesn't come to the forefront besides LadyShea, Vivisectus, and Specious_reasons, we're doomed. You are blind to see that you are no different than those you rail against. I have invested a lot of time in here, which is why it's hard to leave because I know there are questions that could have been answered quite satisfactority, IF Lessans was given half a chance. But he wasn't. I am letting people know that I'm not leaving with my tail between my legs. I'm leaving because this group is being unfair, whether they see why they are being unfair, or not. Prejudice comes in many forms, and the irony is that there is definite prejudice in here, even though people in here think they are more enlightened than the average person. It's very funny to me!! I think I've given you all food for thought, and it can't go beyond that unless more empirical studies are done to confirm what Lessans knew all along. No one knows enough about this knowledge to even explain why a no blame environment will create a paradigm shift, because they haven't understood the two-sided equation. What am I supposed to do? I'm being cornered without any real proof against me. Therefore, the gig is up. I am being forced to say goodbye. Maybe one day you will read this work the way it was meant to be read.

[davidm]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

Therefore, I am being forced to say goodbye.

Buh-bye....

*Back in five, four, three, two, one...*

[Awareness]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about Awareness. Could you please speak more direct?

Yeah, it's above your league when people's feelings are concerned.

Try first to understand people, then you will find out that evelniss is a part of us which can never be banned.
Talking about light is so idiotic, when it comes to what and HOW a human being perceives something.
You could use the pavlov theori to steer people, like commercials do in a negative way, or you could make a better world together, just by only communicating in the fullest scense.
Science is a tool and not a solution Peacegirl.

If you change all the commercials whithout the product all over the world, and broadcasting them every single hour, then the world would change a little.
A life of togetherness without the " bottle of brown colored juice".
Or are we just good for buying CRAP, and consuming BRANDS?

You are taking a U-TURN Peacegirl, the wheel has already served it's purpose.
That eufory you should lose.

[Awareness]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about Awareness. Could you please speak more direct?

Yeah, it's above your league when people's feelings are concerned.

Try first to understand people, then you will find out that evelniss is a part of us which can never be banned.
Talking about light is so idiotic, when it comes to what and HOW a human being perceives something.
You could use the pavlov theori to steer people, like commercials do in a negative way, or you could make a better world together, just by only communicating in the fullest scense.
Science is a tool and not a solution Peacegirl.

If you change all the commercials whithout the product all over the world, and broadcasting them every single hour, then the world would could change a little.
A life of togetherness without the " bottle of brown colored juice".

Or are we just good for buying CRAP, and consuming BRANDS?

You are taking a U-TURN Peacegirl, the wheel has already served it's purpose.
That eufory you should lose.

[Kael]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I just wanted to say that I'm not going to continue the discussion if Lone Ranger cannot accept that science could be wrong, because there's no point. Lessans will be viewed as a jerk, a crackpot, and an ignoramus, and I'm not going to let people disrespect him in this way.

Quick lesson in logic: That A may be wrong does not imply B may be right. Even if we found evidence tomorrow, or today, that demonstrated flaws in our current model of sight, that would do nothing, NOTHING, to counter the volumes (literally) of evidence we already have. Evidence that demonstrates Lessans' claims and ideas about sight are unequivocally, incontrovertibly WRONG. Even your watered-down version, where you no longer defend the most absurd claims he made, like "Nothing impinges on the optic nerve," is wrong. This is completely independent of whether our current understanding and model is wrong.

It is not the "Defenders of Science!" in this thread who cannot accept the possibility of being wrong. There is only one person in the thread who has exhibited that behavior. Want to guess?

Very few people are interested in the actual book. Why?

Speaking only for myself, and despite your claims that you "know what [I'm] thinking," I am not interested because it is full of baseless claims asserted as self-evident fact, completely lacks the tiniest shred of supporting or corroborating evidence, and is horribly written. Were any one of the three not the case it might be worth digesting more thoroughly, but that's a trifecta I cannot endure.

At any rate, see you after your "leave in a huff" phase has passed.

[LadyShea]

Originally Posted by Kael

I am not interested because it is full of baseless claims asserted as self-evident fact, completely lacks the tiniest shred of supporting or corroborating evidence, and is horribly written.

Ditto this for me and add that I find Lessans ideas on love and relationships reprehensible.

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I am being forced to say goodbye.

Nope, you are choosing to say goodbye to protect your dogma.

[Awareness]

I think I've given you all food for thought, and it can't go beyond that unless more empirical studies are done to confirm what Lessans knew all along. No one knows enough about this knowledge to even explain why a no blame environment will create a paradigm shift, because they haven't understood the two-sided equation. What am I supposed to do? I'm being cornered without any real proof against me. Therefore, I am being forced to say goodbye.

For myself you have given nothing Peacegirl, only that some "scientists" can really be PIGHEADED!

Proof is yourself Peacegirl, you do need to start all over again; don't praise the wheel, but praise the person whom is pushing or pulling the carriage.

Forced to say goodbye is weird,when nobody really said hello yet.

I always like to help, you only like to win.

[peacegirl]

I am not going to answer anyone else. It's futile. I may try to get in touch with the Dog Whisperer because he has knowledge on this issue just by observing, like Lessans did, and can give some credence to effererent vision. That's all I have to say because I've been beaten to a pulp, and there's nothing left for me to add. It's so sad because this knowlege is a treasure, but you are all so blind you cannot see. And I don't blame you for this, it just makes me sad.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

Lessans will be viewed as a jerk, a crackpot, and an ignoramus, and I'm not going to let people disrespect him in this way. .

To Late, That ship sailed around 1961.

[specious_reasons]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I just wanted to say that I'm not going to continue the discussion if Lone Ranger cannot accept that science could be wrong, because there's no point.

He's even stated in this thread that the single biggest honor in science is to overturn the status quo. Science could be wrong, it's just really, really unlikely, just as it's really, really, really unlikely that Lessans is correct.

Originally Posted by peacegirl

Lessans will be viewed as a jerk, a crackpot, and an ignoramus, and I'm not going to let people disrespect him in this way.

It's not going to help you any, but I don't think Lessans is a jerk or ignorant. I think he was probably fairly intelligent but awfully enamored with his own ideas. Honestly, his own work "lets" him be seen as a crackpot, especially with the letters to famous people and complaints against the government.

Originally Posted by peacegirl

Very few people are interested in the actual book. Why? Because they are being influenced negatively.

I'm not very interested in the book because I read parts of it...

Originally Posted by peacegirl

They are using the responses to determine if there could be something of value, and if they don't see anyone even considering that there could be something worth considering, why read a 600 page book? I know what they're thinking. They have given up on the legitimacy of Lessans claims; now they are using this as entertainment, similar to a dog fight and they are transfixed on this thread to see who wins. It has nothing to do with the knowledge being presented. I'm not interested in this at all, and if someone else doesn't come to the forefront besides LadyShea, Vivisectus, and Specious_reasons, we're doomed. You are blind to see that you are no different than those you rail against. I have invested a lot of time in here, which is why it's hard to leave because I know there are questions that could have been answered quite satisfactority, IF Lessans was given half a chance. But he wasn't. I am letting people know that I'm not leaving with my tail between my legs. I'm leaving because this group is being unfair, whether they see why they are being unfair, or not. Prejudice comes in many forms, and the irony is that there is definite prejudice in here, even though people in here think they are more enlightened than the average person. It's very funny to me!! I think I've given you all food for thought, and it can't go beyond that unless more empirical studies are done to confirm what Lessans knew all along. No one knows enough about this knowledge to even explain why a no blame environment will create a paradigm shift, because they haven't understood the two-sided equation. What am I supposed to do? I'm being cornered without any real proof against me. Therefore, the gig is up. I am being forced to say goodbye. Maybe one day you will read this work the way it was meant to be read.

Sorry we did a better job of convincing people than you?

[The Lone Ranger]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I just wanted to say that I'm not going to continue the discussion if Lone Ranger cannot accept that science could be wrong, because there's no point.

Well of course science could be wrong on these matters!

It could be the case that pretty-much all of the evidence we've gathered over the past couple of centuries regarding how neurons function is wrong. And it could be that everything we know about the physiology of sight and the anatomy of the visual pathways is wrong. And it could be that the Theory of Relativity is wrong.

I'll happily admit to that.



But I sure as heck ain't gonna bet on it.

Originally Posted by peacegirl

Very few people are interested in the actual book. Why? Because they are being influenced negatively.

As Specious said: I'm not very interested in the book because I actually read parts of it. I wasn't impressed -- at least, not in a good way.

[Stephen Maturin]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

Lessans will be viewed as a jerk, a crackpot, and an ignoramus ...

Yes, but only because he was in fact a jerk, a crackpot and an ignoramus.

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I am being forced to say goodbye.

See ya in a couple of hours.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by specious_reasons

It's not going to help you any, but I don't think Lessans is a jerk or ignorant. I think he was probably fairly intelligent but awfully enamored with his own ideas. :shrug:

Being Intelligent and Ignorant are neither mutually exclusive or linked. One can be either or both. The same would apply to being Enamored with his own Ideas, it doesn't exclude intelligence but it may blind one to the truth and being able to think clearly. Lessans manner of writing seems to have come from his experience in sales and the ability to be glib with a quick wit and answer, but not necessarily based on facts or knowledge. I've had numerous experiences with salesmen where the answer or statement to sway my thinking was total nonsense. Usually these were on subjects where I had enough knowledge to know the salesperson was talking out of his ass. They could be the nicest person you'd want to meet but didn't know what they were talking about.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by specious_reasons

I'm not very interested in the book because I read parts of it...

Don't you know you should have been reading it with the wide-eyed faith of a small child?

[specious_reasons]

Originally Posted by thedoc

Being Intelligent and Ignorant are neither mutually exclusive or linked. One can be either or both. The same would apply to being Enamored with his own Ideas, it doesn't exclude intelligence but it may blind one to the truth and being able to think clearly. Lessans manner of writing seems to have come from his experience in sales and the ability to be glib with a quick wit and answer, but not necessarily based on facts or knowledge. I've had numerous experiences with salesmen where the answer or statement to sway my thinking was total nonsense. Usually these were on subjects where I had enough knowledge to know the salesperson was talking out of his ass. They could be the nicest person you'd want to meet but didn't know what they were talking about.

Oh, exactly. I would say that Lessans was ignorant, in the sense that once he found his truth, nothing else mattered. Not necessarily ignorant of the world, stupid, or incurious.

I'm not actually interested in insulting Lessans. Some conclusions about his work are just.... unavoidable.

[Awareness]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I am not going to answer anyone else. It's futile. I may try to get in touch with the Dog Whisperer because he has knowledge on this issue just by observing, like Lessans did, and can give some credence to effererent vision. That's all I have to say because I've been beaten to a pulp, and there's nothing left for me to add. It's so sad because this knowlege is a treasure, but you are all so blind you cannot see. And I don't blame you for this, it just makes me sad.

Light is just light Peacegirl, the objects do the work, they absorb and reflect.

How you see everything is the answer, especially life.

It's so sad because this knowlege is a treasure, but you are all so blind you cannot see. And I don't blame you for this, it just makes me sad.

You would wish that Peacegirl, would you not?

Also listen very carefully, and be really aware of everything around you.

Hence Awareness.

[erimir]

Originally Posted by peacegirl

They are using the responses to determine if there could be something of value, and if they don't see anyone even considering that there could be something worth considering, why read a 600 page book? I know what they're thinking.

Yes, why read a 600 page book, asks the lady who couldn't be bothered to read 30 some pages about the scientific model of sight?

Why won't people accept that there's a possibility that you are right about sight and science is wrong, even though you haven't actually studied the operation of sight, or even read a summary of the scientific model of sight?

Why indeed?

Prejudice comes in many forms, and the irony is that there is definite prejudice in here, even though people in here think they are more enlightened than the average person.

Who are we prejudiced against, exactly?

People who say stupid things?

I think I've given you all food for thought, and it can't go beyond that unless more empirical studies are done to confirm what Lessans knew all along.

Many - hundreds - of empirical studies have been done. And they have proven that Lessans was wrong.

Sorry. You fail.

Originally Posted by peacegirl

I am not going to answer anyone else. It's futile. I may try to get in touch with the Dog Whisperer because he has knowledge on this issue just by observing, like Lessans did, and can give some credence to effererent vision.

lol so scientific studies are no good, but more anecdotal evidence will convince you!

It's so sad because this knowlege is a treasure, but you are all so blind you cannot see.

lol I don't need sight to see, my other four senses form the image for me!

Blindness isn't even a real disability, doncha know.

[davidm]

Originally Posted by erimir

Yes, why read a 600 page book, asks the lady who couldn't be bothered to read 30 some pages about the scientific model of sight?

Lessans said it, she believes it, that settles it!

[thedoc]

Hey everyone ! if peacegirl really left, could everyone else wrap up what they need to say so we can get the party started? I know it's not 200 pages but if it's over it's over, OK.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

&feature=related

YouTube - girls + noisemakers

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

Too soon?

[thedoc]

Ain't America great? anyone can say anything they want (within reason, and sometimes out) and not get arrested, Yet!

[mickthinks]

World Without Anger | Philosophy Now

Joel Marks is not endorsing Lessan's thesis, but he does go some way along the same path.

[Awareness]

Originally Posted by thedoc

Ain't America great? anyone can say anything they want (within reason, and sometimes out) and not get arrested, Yet!

God I wish!

[Doctor X]

We found what happened to peacegirl.

--J. "But OF COURSE We Would LOVE You to JOIN US!" D.

[Stephen Maturin]

Originally Posted by mickthinks

World Without Anger | Philosophy Now

Very interesting, but it needs moar run-on gibberish, scantily-clad goils, efferent vision, imaginary conversations and frivolous litigation against POTUS. Also, I didn't see a screen of undeniable substance anywhere in Prof. Marks' article.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by Awareness

God I wish!

My Dad used to say, "Wish in one hand, Shit in the other, and see which one gets full the quickest".